066 Sarah Elkins: Your stories don’t define you– how you tell them will

Sarah Elkins never thought she’d be a master at helping people tell stories. She worked in the public sector for 20 years, collecting stories, asking about really specific things, and could repeat them back to them, highlighting some key points.

She started coaching, working with a woman with multiple sclerosis. She never talked about her MS. She didn’t want to be defined by that. Suddenly Sarah realized she had the title for her podcast, and then her book, and really her whole mission.

In this episode learn how Sarah:

  • Became an accidental podcast with over 180 episodes (it’s a great, umm, story, no pun intended)
  • Performs in 2 bands (you can get a listen if you buy the audiobook version of her book, which includes a couple of “bonus tracks”)
  • Realized that people often hate their jobs because of bad communication, and that with better communication, people would have a better work experience and better relationships.
  • Realized that people often held judgements about themselves and others based on stories they told themselves that weren’t necessarily true or complete, but had come to define them, and often limit their success.
  • Helped a speaking client wow a crowd and exorcise some childhood trauma.

Plus learn the common fallacies that hold us back when telling our stories:

  • That the have to be epic to be meaningful (Sarah has a great example of this in the interview).
  • Thinking in terms of lengthy timelines, rather than specific instances that illustrate the whole story
  • Telling your story in a way that puts yourself down (“I’m not very bright…”)
  • Not sharing emotions– which activate mirror neurons in the head of the listener

And some things you may not consider about telling your story:

  • Memory is fallible, and even just retelling the story shifts the memory.
  • There’s no such thing as a lightbulb moment. There’s a dimmer switch.” We don’t remember the little things that lead to the full light.
  • You can have multiple origin stories. One way to find them is to think of times you have been insulted and felt small. For example, you might have a lot of evidence that you’re smart and accomplished, but one story that suggests you’re not, and you end up believing the one negative story.
  • Put your stories into categories, so you have relevant stories to share in the right situations. (This sounds like it will take a lot of time, but we’re always telling stories anyway.)

And again– we’ve actually got video for this episode on YouTube or see below…


The Wine

Sarah is drinking an Old Fashioned that her husband made.

Reuben is drinking Thomas Jerry 7 Hills Oregon Blend Vineyard 60 cab 28 merlot 12 cab franc.

Books and More

Your Stories Don’t Define You, How You Tell Them Will.

Audio Book version– free extra tracks 2 songs from Spare Change, one of the bands Sarah is in (the other band is called Rocket to Uranus, a 60s cover band).


Where to find Sarah

listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”. You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Note, speaking of stories, a good proposal is a story, not a brochure– get your “Fill in the Blank” Consulting Proposal Template.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”. (Including the more powerful than ever Free Edition.) Mimiran can help you implement a lot of Sarah’s ideas not only more efficiently, but more effectively, including telling your Origin Story, plus tracking referrals, maintaining relationships through conversations, and more, proposal automation, lead magnets, e-signature, and more.


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065 David Newman on Marketing for Consultants

I got introduced to David Newman through Ellen Melko Moore (check out her episode on using LinkedIn effectively) and have loved his newsletter and webinars, so I asked him to join me on Sales for Nerds because he has a wonderful way of explaining marketing concepts in “plain English” that’s not only clear and compelling, but also entertaining, cutting through the haze of B.S. that fogs up most marketing advice.

But David took a long, strange path to get here, getting weeded out of pre-med, then earning a theater degree (one of my regrets is not returning to this in the interview), before getting into consulting and training.

In this episode learn:

  • How David learned to listen to people who were trying to give him money (and how that transformed his business and accounts for 98% of his revenue). This also gets back to the importance of having real-life conversations…
  • How and why he moved from corporate training to helping other consultants.
  • How we built a thriving business despite terrible timing (starting out on his own right before 9/11, publishing a book on speaking right before COVID) and struggling to find his niche at the beginning.
  • Why he (and you) needed help (“nobody does anything great alone”).
  • How to stop treating sales and marketing with disdain, while avoid the “ickiness” that comes from treating service sales like product sales.
  • How to avoid “same-o lame-o” websites and create compelling proposals.
  • How to separate yourself from the bad consultants who have burned your prospects in the past (“clients rarely get a chance to commoditize consultants– consultants are too busy doing it themselves”).
  • How to be an effective “professional irritant” (“if you don’t risk turning some people off, you can’t turn anyone on”)
  • How to market well (and be referable): make sure your prospects and partners know exactly what you do, and can repeat it. (“If you’re not repeatable, you’re not referable.”)
  • Why great copy isn’t written, it’s “listened”

And again– we’ve actually got video for this episode. See below…


Audio only…

The Wine

David enjoys some Spindrift Pink Lemonade seltzer, while Reuben enjoyed some Willful Pinot Noir from Willamette Valley, Oregon.

Books and More

Do It! Marketing. Just go get David’s book. (Just do it, you might say…)


Where to find David

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Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”. You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Note, speaking of “plain English” proposals, you can also get your “Fill in the Blank” Consulting Proposal Template.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”. (Including the more powerful than ever Free Edition.) Mimiran can help you implement a lot of Michelle’s ideas not only more efficiently, but more effectively, including tracking referrals, maintaining relationships through conversations, and more.


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064 Michelle Tillis Lederman on Forging Genuine Connections

Michelle Tillis Lederman worked in the finance department, crunching numbers, until a chance trip to Japan and an interesting coaching experience led her to launch her own business, helping people connect with each other better.

The “recovering CPA” has written several books, and her latest, The Connector’s Advantage: 7 Mindsets to Grow Your Influence and Impact was what led to this conversation.

In this episode learn:

  • How to achieve your goals faster, easier, and better with help from your connections (and feel better along the way)
  • How to bring your natural strengths and “unique charms” to conversations, instead of trying to force yourself to be someone else (especially helpful for introverts)
  • How to find points of connection
  • How to be stay in a place of curiosity and openness instead of jumping to conclusions, and why this is so important
  • How to keep connections alive and healthy, without being fake
  • The importance of picking up the phone and calling people, even if you’re busy (yes!!!)

Plus, Michelle takes notes as our conversation leads to ideas for 2 blog posts. 😉


And again– we’ve actually got video for this episode. See below…


Audio only…

The Wine

Michelle had a bottle of Poland Springs. 😉 With summer in full swing in Texas, Reuben switched to white, a Ribbonwood Sauvignon Blanc from New Zealand.

Books and More

The Connector’s Advantage: 7 Mindsets to Grow Your Influence and Impact. A nice, quick read, with plenty of practical advice.

It’s also a nice compliment to Matthew Pollard’s book, The Introvert’s Edge to Networking (listen to Matthew on Sales for Nerds here).


Where to find Michelle

listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”. You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”. (Including the more powerful than ever Free Edition.) Mimiran can help you implement a lot of Michelle’s ideas not only more efficiently, but more effectively, including tracking referrals, maintaining relationships through conversations, and more.


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063 Diane Helbig on how to Succeed without Selling

Unlike most of us, Diane grew up with a father who was “everything good about sales”. Yet she still hated the thought of going into sales.

Learn how she overcame that fear and followed in her father’s footsteps as an honest, authentic, problem-solving sales rep.

Diane, is an author (see book recommendation below), advisor, award-winning-speaker, host of the Accelerate Your Business Growth, member of the Newsweek Expert Forum, and the National Small Business Association Leadership Council.

(As a side note, we have been trying to schedule this interview for a while, but I needed time to get around to reading Diane’s excellent book, Succeed without Selling, and when we finally had an interview scheduled, Diane lost power.)

In this episode learn how:

  • Diane changed her perspective on selling so she could be herself.
  • To understand what prospects actually need, so you don’t assume everyone is a prospect.
  • To network effectively not to sell, but to build your community.
  • To define your target market and research people.
  • To get introductions.
  • To go for the conversation, not the sale.
  • To use LinkedIn effectively (do you have your high school on your profile?).
  • To be “you”– if people do business with people they trust, how can they do business with you if you’re not authentic. (“Stop lying!”)
  • To ask budget questions.

And again– we’ve actually got video for this episode. See below…


Audio only…

The Wine

Diane had a glass of 19 Crimes Snoop Cali Red (just look at this bottle). Despite the name, 19 Crimes is an Australian brand, playing off the crimes that could get English people deported.

Reuben had a glass of Chateau Bucasse from Madiran, Gascony in the southwest of France. It’s 60% Tannat (see wikipedia entry here), 20% Cabernet Sauvignon, 20% Cab Franc. If you have a Costco membership, grab a bottle for $14 (it was recently featured on ReverseWineSnob.com as a great deal).

Books and More

Succeed Without Selling: The More You Think About Selling, the Less You Will Sell. A wonderful book– check it out. It’s an easy, practical read, and I wish I’d read this when I was starting my consulting practice, instead of some of the “hardcore” sales books I read, that asked me to be someone else, instead of leaning into who I am.


Where to find Diane

listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”, (Mimiran also makes it easy to track and grow referrals). You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”. (Including the more powerful than ever Free Edition.) Mimiran can help you implement a lot of Diane’s ideas not only more efficiently, but more effectively.


Get alerted when there are new episodes (1x/month):

062 Reuben Swartz on MEGA Positioning, your secret superpower

Reuben Swartz, Host and Chief Nerd

Hi, I’m back with another solo episode, because I’ve spent so much time recently talking with people about positioning that I wanted to do an episode on it.

So many people struggle with sales and marketing, because they have created a high degree of difficulty for themselves by not taking advantage of positioning.

In this episode learn how:

  • To focus your messaging on your ideal clients
  • How to overcome FOMO (Fear of Missing Out) when you narrow your niche
  • “MEGA” Positioning, the world’s cheesiest marketing pneumonic:
    • Magnetic (and what people get wrong about it)
    • Easy (because this is the dial you use to make sales and marketing easier or harder)
    • Gorilla (how to make yourself the 800 pound gorilla of your market)
    • Authentic (you’ve got to be true to yourself)
  • How to create your Superhero Name and tell your Origin StoryHow to use “The Bar Test” to check your messaging and make sure it resonates
  • Why strong positioning with a narrower nice leads to more leads, not less
  • How to develop your positioning when you get “stuck”

Try the Mission & Positioning Tool for free.


The Wine

Chateau Satarney Pinot Noir from Burgandy, 2015. Yum.


listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”, (Mimiran also makes it easy to track and grow referrals). You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”. (Including the more powerful than ever Free Edition.) Mimiran can help you implement a lot of Alan’s ideas not only more efficiently, but more effectively.


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061 Alan Weiss on Million Dollar Consulting

Alan Weiss is perhaps the original consultant to consultants, author of the seminal Million Dollar Consulting (and dozens of other books on business and life).

Million Dollar Consulting was my lifeline when I started consulting, so I’ve always wanted to Alan to come on Sales for Nerds because if you haven’t read his stuff, you need to hear his advice.

In this episode learn how Alan:

  • Turned around a money-losing division early in his career, with a brain dead simple tactic you should be using now.
  • Realized that hourly billing was unethical.
  • Saw how tech consultants become a “pair of hands” instead of a “brain” and commoditize themselves
  • Asks questions to move up the corporate ladder to decision makers.
  • Taps into the emotional needs of buyers so they can take action (“logic makes people think, emotion makes people act”).
  • Uses a “helping” instead of a “selling” mindset to interact with decision makers as peers.
  • Builds a verifies trust quickly.

Also, Alan notes that there are a lot of excellent consultants who can’t market and a lot mediocre consultants who are great at marketing. Most consultants are too timid– they try not to lose business instead of going aggressively to win business.

Alan also offers a simple 3 step plan for building pipeline.

  1. Call everyone you know. “Don’t hide behind email.” Can I get an “amen”? Ask for referrals. (Want an easier way to do this? Try Mimiran, the CRM for solo consultants who hate “selling”, with Call Mode included in free and paid plans.)
  2. Treat networking as a process to set up subsequent meetings. Forge connections, don’t aim for sales.
  3. Host events that offer value to your ideal client. (Virtual or in person.)

When you get meetings with prospects:

  1. establish a trusting relationship– offer value from the start
  2. look at the client’s issues (not just “pain”)
  3. create conceptual agreement on what needs to happen– objectives, measures, and value
  4. “pour cement”– offer to have a proposal for them the next day, with a meeting scheduled to review it the following day. Ask if there is anything other than fees that would prevent them from selecting one of the options you will give them.

Plus, learn:

  • Why buyers care about more than saving money and avoiding pain.
  • How to uncover the personal objective behind every business objective.
  • Signs the client trusts you
  • Why doing things internally is harder and more expensive than hiring you
  • Why businesses need to keep climbing
  • How to be a peer and not a subordinate
  • Why Alan is optimistic about 2021 and why you should consider volatility and disruption offensive weapons

And again– we’ve actually got video for this episode. See below…


Audio only…

The Wine

Alan enjoyed Marietta Cellars Armé cabernet (which has a little merlot, malbec, and petit verdot blended in). This goes for about $26 from the vineyard and Alan says it will go well with any steak. Reuben had some Franciscan cabernet sauvignon (looks like it was a cab interview).

Books and More

Million Dollar Consulting (now in its 5th edition!). Read this if you haven’t already, and check out Alan’s author page, with dozens of books. I won’t list them all here, but definitely check out Alan’s new book, Your Legacy Is Now: Life is Not a Search for Meaning from Others — It’s the Creation of Meaning for Yourself.


Where to find Alan

listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”, (Mimiran also makes it easy to track and grow referrals). You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”. (Including the more powerful than ever Free Edition.) Mimiran can help you implement a lot of Alan’s ideas not only more efficiently, but more effectively.


Get alerted when there are new episodes (1x/month):

060 Doug Brown on common sales mistakes

Doug Brown on Sales for Nerds

Doug Brown grew up steeped in business, starting at the whopping salary of $0.25 per week when he was 3, sweeping the floors of his father’s shop. He also accompanied his mom, a nurse by day and Avon sales rep by night, learning to calculate commissions when most of us were just learning basic arithmetic.

But that was just the beginning. Listen to hear how Doug:

  • Learned the value of leverage and freedom
  • Chose to join the army anyway, to pay for college, and how he made it work for him (including investing in calculators to replace slide rules to calculate artillery trajectories)
  • While getting a degree in nuclear medicine, he started selling music equipment, and realized he could make 3X the money selling amps versus making $13/hr doing nuclear medicine
  • Sold equipment to bands like Aerosmith, Boston, The Eagles, and Billy Joel’s band (along with lot of other lucrative customers), and what lessons that has for your business
  • Got into telecom sales and extended his sales philosophy from music sales
  • Had 2 kids in diapers and a skyrocketing sales career, he started his own business, and almost lost everything
  • Got introduced to Chet’s Holmes’ Ultimate Sales Machine training by Jay Conrad Levinson, and dropped $4,000 on the course. But that took his business to almost $1M in 15 months
  • Grew a 7-figure business with strong recurring revenue, but didn’t really like what he was doing
  • A client had told him he would make a good coach, so he called Chet Holmes’ president of coaching with some ideas and within 6 months was the top grossing coach in the organization.
  • Helped grow the coaching organization, then part of the Tony Robbins empire from 18% to 42% conversion and reduced the refund rate from 15% to less than 1%
  • His daughter cold called every GM in the NHL (you have to hear this story).

Here are the big mistakes Doug sees that you can avoid:

  • Ignoring outbound sales
  • Trying to scale before you have a stable system to scale
  • Treating coaching or consulting as a business– it’s only part of the business, you also need the system for getting clients repeated-ably
  • Using a bunch of sales and marketing tactics without an actual strategy
  • Not asking for specific help from people who would love to help you

And again– we’ve actually got video for this episode. See below…


The Wine

Reuben had some Rural Pinot Noir from Costco.

Doug had water.

Books and More

Guerrilla Marketing: Easy and Inexpensive Tactics for Making Big Profits from your Small Business, by Jay Conrad Levinson

The Ultimate Sales Machine: Turbocharge Your Business with Relentless Focus on 12 Key Strategies, by Chet Holmes

Differentiate or Die: Survival in Our Era of Killer Competition, by Jack Trout


Where to find Doug

  • BusinessSuccessFactors.com (doug@businesssuccessfactors.com)
  • 605-595-0303
  • LinkedIn
listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”, (Mimiran also makes it easy to track and grow referrals). You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”. (Including the new Free Edition that helps you nail your positioning, your Superhero Name, and your origin story.)


Get alerted when there are new episodes (1x/month):

059: Bob Burg on how to be a Go-Giver

Bob Burg, the Go-Giver

Bob Burg is the co-author of The Go-Giver (along with several other books), a former Gold Gloves champion, and so much more. Bob started off with a book called Endless Referrals.

Bob notes that people connect with “stories” more than instructions. Bob wanted to take the premise of his first book– Endless Referrals, which was that all things being equal, people want to refer people they know, like, and trust, and turn it into a story or parable. Bob, in his modest way, says that the best thing he did for that book was get John David Mann as the co-author to make it more of a story.

After boxing and college, he was a broadcaster on a TV show, but knew that wasn’t for him, so he got into sales. He floundered because he didn’t have any real training. Found some books in the book store, which was harder to do back then, and his sales results started to improve.

Bob believes that you can achieve anything (within reason), if you have a predictable, improvable system.

People who say they don’t like “selling”, don’t like what they thinking selling is.

“Selling is discovering what the other person does need, want, and desire, and helping them get it.”

Bob Burg

“The old English root is sellen, which means “to give” (or “to give for money”, see more on the etymology here).

Bob believes that sales people are needed more than ever, they’re just not needed as information dispensers.

The Trade Secret is giving… being a go-getter– a person of action, is great, just don’t be a go-taker.

Shifting your focus from getting to giving– constantly and consistently providing immense value to others– will give you great results. Nobody is going to buy from you because you have a quota, or even because you’re a nice person– they buy from you if it is in their interest.

In the book, Bob and John introduce the 5 laws…

  1. The Law of Value– give so much more in value that you price. The buyer and the seller both profit from the exchange.
  2. The Law of Compensation– your income is determined by how many people you serve and how well you serve them.
  3. The Law of Influence– your influence is determined by how abundantly you place other people’s interests first.
  4. The Law of Authenticity– the most valuable gift you have to offer is yourself. Hard to show up as ourselves if we can’t identify and embrace your strengths. 3 weaknesses (ignore, mitigate, changed)
  5. The Law of Receptivity– the key to effective giving means staying open to receiving. Horrendous messages… Giving and receiving are two sides of the same coin (not giving and taking– that’s different). Have to be willing to price appropriately.

Bob notes that all 5 laws are congruent with human nature– you’re not trying to make yourself or someone else someone beyond human capabilities.

Bob thinks we absorb a lot of unhealthy messages about prosperity, that the way to achieve wealth is to be dishonest and/or mistreat people. He recommends some other folks to counteract this, like Randy Gage, Bob Proctor, Sharon Lector (Rich Dad, Poor Dad), Ken Honda (Happy Money).

A lot of people feel they aren’t good at sales because they’re not big talkers– but selling from listening, not talking.

To get started being a go-giver, build on your successes. Ask “how can I add value to other human beings?”


And again– we’ve actually got video for this episode. See below…


The Wine

Reuben had some 2106 Chateaux Chemin Royale from Bordeaux.

Bob had water.

Books and More

The Go-Giver: A little story about a powerful business idea, by Bob Burg and John David Mann.

Endless Referrals: network your everyday contacts into sales, by Bob Burg.

How to Win Friends and Influence People, by Dale Carnegie.

Think and Grow Rich, by Napoleon Hill.

Psychocybernetics, by Maxwell Maltz.

The Magic of Thinking Big, by David Schwartz.

How to Fail at Almost Everything and Still Win Big, by Scott Adams.


Where to find Bob

  • Burg.com. Read the first chapter of any of Bob’s books. Also check out the podcast, a blog, social links, and a free mini course on “selling the go-giver way”.
  • LinkedIn
listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”, (Mimiran also makes it easy to track and grow referrals). You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”.


Get alerted when there are new episodes (1x/month):

058: Reuben Swartz on what I’ve learned this decade– I mean year

Reuben Swartz, Host and Chief Nerd

What have we learned from this year? Too much and not enough, it seems…

I share some of what I’ve learned– what I’m hopeful about and what I’m not, and my simple advice for 2021.

The Wine

It’s New Years Eve– wine will come later. Although probably not after 10PM or so…


listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”, (Mimiran also makes it easy to track and grow referrals). You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”.

Some particular features that may help with having more conversations:


Get alerted when there are new episodes (1x/month):

057: Angelique Rewers helps you sell to corporate clients (without proposals)

Inc. Magazine called Angelique Rewers “the undisputed champion at helping small businesses land big clients”, and in this episode, Angelique pulls back the curtain on how she started her consulting business (accidentally, of course), and how she pivoted into helping other consultants.

In this episode, learn how Angelique:

  • How Angelique launched her own consulting business after 10 years working for someone else.
  • How she got her first clients, and how it wasn’t where she expected.
  • How her business struggled, and how a friend helped her get it on the right track over margaritas (another reason Angelique is a great fit for the show).
  • Why (and how) you have to call everyone you know, instead of wasting time on busywork. (Amen!)
  • Why buyers ghost you (and what you can do about it).
  • A reminder that you can “date” ideas– you don’t have to marry them, especially when you are getting started.
  • How to “bridge” from one conversation or speaking engagement to deeper connection with buyers.
  • How to block out time in your calendar for outreach and “drag, don’t delete”, when needed.

Here are some common mistakes people make trying to sell to big companies (I wouldn’t know anything about that):

  • Content is a commodity. Conversations and cash flow are kings. Don’t spend too much time creating stuff that no one’s reading or that doesn’t move the needle on sales. When you do content, push it through industry outlets so that your ideal clients will see it.
  • Make sure you have a “red velvet rope” to keep out the wrong prospects (like “a-holes”)
  • Trying to sell to pain points instead of the buyer’s to-do list. (Hear how one of Angelique’s clients did this with her.)
  • Making the buyer want to “dodge” you– this means you’re being too sales-y, whether that’s your intent or not.
  • Trying to make things more urgent than the buyer thinks– they already have too much urgent stuff. Just help them instead of trying to sell them (and hopefully you hear the magic words, “I’ve never thought of it that way before”).
  • Apologizing for doing your job and asking questions. Don’t worry about looking stupid.
  • Not leading the buyer through the process.
  • Forgetting that buyers are human, too. They have stresses, feelings, and whatever changes we see in markets and technology, we’re still dealing with people.
  • Trying to win deals with proposals (we have a big conversation about what this means, and how you should do it) and guessing what the client needs.
  • Don’t be boring– have fun with how you (re)connect with people.
  • Don’t think that everyone is against you– a lot of people are rooting for you.

Do be helpful, be human, and make it easy to buy, and do take the mental heavy lifting off your prospects’ shoulders.

And– we’ve actually got video for this episode. See below…


The Wine

Reuben had some Wind Gap Pinot Noir, while Angelique had the red blend from @GaryVee‘s Empathy Wines.

Books and More

Selling the Invisible, A Field Guide to Modern Marketing by Harry Beckwith, which has the great notion that Angelique mentions– “if you listen closely enough, your customers will describe your business to you.”

Kolbe Testing— what Angelique mentions a couple of times, designed to help you figure out how your brain works best.


Where to find Angelique

listen-on-apple-podcasts-sales-for-nerds

Where you can find Reuben: @Sales4Nerds, @Mimiran, Mimiran.com, the easy CRM for people who are awesome at serving clients and would love some help getting more, but hate “selling”, (Mimiran also makes it easy to track and grow referrals). You can also  listen on Overcast, or Subscribe on Android, or Player.fm.

Want a way to make sales and marketing fun, without being “salesy”? Try Mimiran, the CRM for elite solo consultants who love serving clients but who hate “selling”.


Get alerted when there are new episodes (1x/month):